TNR Vs. Zuniga - Not Even Fair
Lee Siegel at TNR has been getting the full Koz Kidz deluge after a piece he wrote about Kos. He's not impressed with the thuggishness.
At the end of my post yesterday, I wrote, "The blogosphere's fanaticism is, in many ways, the triumph of a lack of focus." It just so happens that on his blog today, none other than Andrew Sullivan, hardly an ideological soulmate of mine, quotes Santayana: "Fanaticism consists of redoubling your efforts when you have forgotten your aim." Sure enough, fanaticism ruled in the responses to what I wrote yesterday.
"Moron"; "Wanker" (a favorite blogofascist insult, maybe because of the similarity between the most strident blogging and masturbating); and "Asshole" have been the three most common polemical gambits. A reactor even had the gall to refer to me as a "conservative." Another resourceful adversarialist invited me to lick his scrotum. Please send a picture and a short essay describing your favorite hobbies. One madly ambitious blogger, who has been alternately trying to provoke and fawning over TNR writers in an attempt to break down the door–I'm too polite to mention any names–even asked who it was at TNR who gave me "the keys to a blog."
All these abusive attempts to autocratically or dictatorially control criticism came about because I said that the blogosphere had the quality of fascism, which my dictionary defines as "any tendency toward or actual exercise of severe autocratic or dictatorial control." The proof, you might say, is in the puddingheads.
Well, I think Siegel may be painting with too broad a brush. It's really not the whole blogosphere, I think. Just a certain portion. However, Kos and Kompany may be sustaining some long term damage here to their credibility with the mainstream media. The post I put up earlier about the Martin Peretz smackdown plus this bodyblow from Siegel are hurting Kos and his followers. The longer they keep up the full attack mode, the more shrill and out of control they will be seen by more people. I don't think that will be a winning strategy.
I still want some ring girls, though!
Blogosphere, Left Wing | Gaius June 24, 2006
By crosspatch, June 24, 2006 @ 3:34 pm
While I would agree with Siegal to some extent, like you, I believe he is painting with too broad a brush in his criticism of blogs and blogging. To use my particular case as an example, I am not a writer but I do have opinions and blogs provide me with a forum to express them, feeble as my attempts at it might be. Not being a wordsmith, what I build will not be as pretty nor as durable but it will convey the general idea.
No I do agree that there is a certain herd mentality when it comes to certain blogs and bloggers. But I would also say that there are many who do read blogs that hold different views because that is how one learns. And there are those of us who would offer debate when we encounter differing opinions as it is how we plumb the ideas behind those opinions and behind our own opinions as well.
There is one thing that I will agree strongly with, though. There is a group who when encountering an opinion which differs from theirs, seems to take the difference of opinion as some kind of personal invalidation. They respond to a different opinion as if they have been personally attacked and often get defensive or worse, feel a need to launch a “counter-attack” when not attack on them was intended. I believe this is a result of one holding one’s opinions too closely to their sense of self. In order to be healthy, one must be able to learn and allow their opinions to adapt and change as we evolve over the years. If we stand our personal identity on our opinions, we become rigid in our thinking and changing of opinion shakes the foundations of self identity and can cause emotional problems not the least of which is irrational behavior when confronted with alternative points of view. In that case, one must defend one’s positions tooth and nail even in the face of clear information that our opinion might be wrong. We would become angry at the one who would show us our conclusions are wrong and lash out at them. One would then either submit to the new information, accept its validity, and become lost as their former sense of self has been shattered and flail about seeking some new way to define their identity or they simply close their minds to the new information, gang togehter with others holding the same view, stick their collective fingers in their ears and throw rocks at anyone who dares threaten their conclusions. That this point their conclusions and opinoins become religion. They are then held with faith with no basis in logic.
The opinions at Kos are really religions beliefs rather than logical conclusions and the reaction you are witnessing from them is the same as that when someone’s religion is attacked. I challange you to go on any of the blogs in that circle and speak “heresey”. Blasphemy will be punished swiftly with excommunication and you will be banned from the blog and your comments deleted. They are not interested in debate, they are not interested in defending or evolving or learning. They believe they have it right and anyone attacking their beliefs is attacking them personally and they respond as such.
I am interested in seeing Markos answer one question. The question I would ask him is “What are you?”. I would, if asked, say “Dad” or “an engineer”. My self identity doesn’t reside on a foundation of political opinion so I can adapt a lot easier, accept criticism, engage in debate, leave a debate alone, modify my position, learn things. I suspect Markos’ answer might be “A Liberal”. And that would explain a lot of his behavior when his political views are challanged.
By Gaius, June 24, 2006 @ 3:38 pm
You’ve hit the nail I think. The reaction is that of the faithful to blasphemy. In the worst, extreme forms.
By crosspatch, June 24, 2006 @ 4:24 pm
I actually turned this comment into a post on my blog and expanded on it a little. I noticed the same behavior a week or so ago at another lefty blog where they were deleting comments when someone would argue a point of logic.
By Dean Esmay, June 24, 2006 @ 4:59 pm
“Shrill and out of control” has always been the exact correct description for Daily Kos. It is not alone in that regard among blogs, but it’s not typical of blogs either. It’s one section. One particularly loud, bullying, obnoxious section.
By Jim Treacher, June 24, 2006 @ 5:24 pm
That group even has a name: children.
By TallDave, June 24, 2006 @ 6:01 pm
You know, Howard Dean was known as a moderate centrist before he hooked up with the Kos krowd. Thereafter he was known for screaming and advancing bizarre 9/11 conspiracy theories. Coincidence?
By Ken, June 24, 2006 @ 6:23 pm
Quality of fascism? Really? Because they were” autocratically or dictatorially, trying to “control criticism?”
Maybe, in reality, they were just trying to insult you. Occam’s Razor, man.
By Shawn, June 24, 2006 @ 7:28 pm
Kos and the Kossacks are living the thug life. Dean is right about it being, “one particularly loud, bullying, obnoxious section.”
By Gaius, June 24, 2006 @ 8:17 pm
Yeah, it is a small section, Dean. The problem right now is the broad brush that is being used to describe them slops over onto those who are not behaving that way.
You’re right, Jim. Children. With poor behavior control skills.
Crosspatch - I read that post when I went over to your place. Nice job.
By K T Cat, June 24, 2006 @ 9:34 pm
Just chill out about the ring girls. I’m working on it.
Don’t blame me if you don’t like the results. Remember, you asked for it.
By Gaius, June 24, 2006 @ 9:39 pm
Uh oh. This sounds bad. I think I may have nightmares……
By K T Cat, June 24, 2006 @ 10:09 pm
OK, here you go.
http://ktcatspost.blogspot.com/2006/06/ring-girls-for-kos-tnr-fight.html
You’re welcome.
By Gaius, June 24, 2006 @ 10:19 pm
I linked this one in a post - great, great job. Real hotties. Whoo hoo!
By K T Cat, June 24, 2006 @ 10:29 pm
Thanks!
By K T Cat, June 24, 2006 @ 10:30 pm
By the by, did you catch the technorati tags?
By Gaius, June 24, 2006 @ 10:43 pm
A thing of beauty. A real thing of beauty.
Where’s that Drano?
By Shawn, June 25, 2006 @ 2:39 pm
Your Technorati tags belie the pics…until you click on them. Then it all falls into place.